They are not immune to wear. Gas piston is a single whole unit so itâs lighter . The Crosman didn't change much. Ithaca Gunner ; I got a Nitro Venom .22 cal two years ago and had similar problems with mine . Maybe a German nitro piston the quality of the RWS would be better. I think ou will be unhappy to have to "break in" the nitro every time you take it out. A British Group maybe 30 years ago got the idea of gas piston from Argentinians and around 1980s gas piston was introduced . Some guys just hear the “artillery hold" and that’s all they will use. Spring piston or gas ram? You could always get a after market trigger. If you buy a good spring piston rifle mainly those of Germans . Basically, a gas piston air gun (also called gas strut, gas ram) works the same way as the spring piston gun but a gas ram gun has a gas-filled cylinder instead of a coiled spring. So, if you canât decide between a gas-impingement and a piston AR, get both, shoot them both and find out for yourself if the piston is an answer to a problem that never existed. My 48 in .177 and 52 in .22 would get goofy in the really cold weather(20's).That darn lube on the spring get pretty stiff. He’s a great guy to deal with and fast on the turn around. One of the hottest topics of debates between air gunners is the power source behind the pellet. The air in the cylinder is already compressed and you apply more pressure to it when you cock the gun. With the gas piston system, gas is funneled from the barrel to drive a piston that works the action. The Nitro Venom so-so at best rifle from my personal shooting with it. The mechanism works the same way a conventional spring-piston airgun powerplant: when you cock a breakbarrel rifle equipped with a gas ram or Nitro Piston, you drive the piston down the cylinder (further compressing the gas inside the cylinder, which is comparable to compressing the spring in a conventional spring powerplant) until it latches. Your email address will not be published. With all the major brands including Gamo, Benjamin and Crosman Pyramyd Air has become your go-to source for gas spring and nitro piston rifles for air gun enthusiasts of all skill levels. which one is better spring or gas piston ? I'd like opinions and a discussion on the good and bad of both. A tight hold like Papa Smurf suggested didn't help it either. It's quiet, I guess.... Just not nearly as quiet as an Aguila Super Calibri out of my 22. :). Unlike a spring gun which will continue to work with a broken spring, though with less power, when the gas piston fails, you're done. In principle because a gas is a perfectly compressable medium compared to a spring which has is governed by a more approximately linear equation kx - it is theoretically reasonable that you can get more out of a gas piston. It's usually a 3/4" shooter at that distance with Crossman Premier hollow points. A typical gas piston knocks 3 QUARTER OF POUND out of guns total weight . I shot both at a 55gal. The three main power sources available in airgunning are at â¦ But then again, I have never shot a springer, so I could be mistaken. It gotta main traditional coil spring , a heavy piston and spring guard that guides the spring to be in a straight shape and prevents the vibration in the spring . Check the lockup of the barrel. That brings us to two types of pellet rifles, traditional spring piston, and newer gas piston. I like things simple as possible, nothing extra to lug around I don't have to, no pumps to pre-charge, no co2 cartridges. IF YOU ASK ME OR ANY OTHER AIRGUN EXPERT THE ONLY ANSWER WILL YOU GET IS YES, OF COURSE SPRING, Automotive WordPress Theme Copyright@2019. Proceed with search disclosed that gas piston air rifle have been used for about 40 years and the spring piston rifles are older than it. I do have a chrony. In this article, Ron Jones concludes his exploration of the differences between spring piston and gas ram airguns. Given that pushing it is unmatched con Springs don't leak. Gas Piston powered airguns eliminate most of the vibration caused by the oscillation of the heavy springs used in spring powered airguns. The point is, what one person finds the he can't live with may be what the next guy finds to be something he can't live without. Not mine, quiet as a church mouse, yet more powerful than my RWS 34 with the same pellets and same target. Mike tuned the Quattro trigger, did the standard deburr and generally cleaned things up. Sooner or later the gas piston will leak. I have a nitro venom, and it shoots pretty well in .22. @Get Started Air Rifle Gas Piston Vs Spring And Air Rifle Scope With Rangefinder will be my personal favorite goods brought out this 7 days. My opinion is that the Crosman is a entry level gas piston gun and fully $100.00 less than the RWS-34. Check the crown for defects. Airgun Letter did a story on it I think. drum in about 60 degree weather, the gas piston was the more powerful of the two making a noticeably deeper impression. It's called the "alive jam" on the parts schematic. Groups opened up to around 2" and shot low. The cold weather this past week, (highs in the teens) gave me a bit of insight. It means mechanism is not universal . Been thinking of the Hatsan 95 Vortex, or the Weihrauch HW 90. +1 on a mild tuneup on the 34 ,you will be pleased. Due to lighter weight gas spring air rifle are good for field practice . My 76 year old eyes added to the mix don't help. One stroke, load and shoot! Pellet rifles can be picky about which pellet it likes as well. Do you have a chronograph? But if gas piston is not made of high quality i have actually seen scopes and mount rail falling and breaking out of gun . It looked like I was beginning to make progressâ¦ It looked like I was beginning to make progressâ¦ Now I could see if a rookie shooter (that would be me) could prove or disprove the field accuracy potential claimed by the manufacturer, but downplayed by â¦ It'll out penetrate my RWS-34 by a considerable margin and it's easier to cock, and nearly as silent as you could expect. When you cock the gun and the piston is driven backward it compresses this gas. "Steel spring guns, you can't leave them cocked while walking in the woods, the twang is loud, and you have to use the artillery hold to get good accuracy due to the reverse-recoil of the spring.". Big difference in price, but I'm kind of addicted to the German quality in air guns. I was an early adopter, too. Itâs the motion of the spring resuming its original shape that drives the piston forward. If you are s In gas-operation, a portion of high-pressure gas from the cartridge being fired is used to power a mechanism to dispose of the spent case and insert a new cartridge into the chamber . Maybe next time Pyramid Air has a sale I'll get better gas piston rifle as I like to shoot pellet rifles mostly in the winter. The simple solution is to shoot the gun every few weeks, this keeps the seals from sticking. 5. Piston is pushed by the spring when you cock the gun the piston pushes the spring into compressed state and when you fire the piston releases and pushed forward by the spring that pushes the air out of the piston through air transfer port behind the pellet . You just wait until you enter the next phase and start tuning. The spring-piston air rifle works by the power of a cylinder compressing air whereas the gas piston has a gas-filled cylinder instead of a coiled spring. Gas Piston models oscillate much less and finish the action cycle in less time than spring powered models making for a more comfortable confident shooting experience. Yes, Harry, there's always exceptions... but for the majority of spring guns what I said is true. You might also improve the horizontal lockup with brass washers. They last longer but not much difference than of spring piston . One of our resident airgun experts, Jason Whittle, ways up the advantages and disadvantagesâ¦. I'd prefer to get it right the first time around, so I'm just fine with dropping an extra $100 (i.e. When you break the barrel, it's the part that sticks out under where you insert the pellet. I have a gas spring Theoben and have not seen the issues you describe with the the nitro. And fixing it up yourself, you can more than likely make it better than the average out-the-box rifle and keep it maintained to that level, to boot. Anybody have a Hatsan 95 Vortex? I got mine right after they were introduced, maybe they got better, I won't chance another for sure. I have seen a POI issue when the Theoben had spent the summer work day in my truck, It was hot and thus had more (much more) pressure . At first I thought it was the scope, but no less than 4 have been on it with the same results. He just did a 95 for himself. when you fire it relaxes back but not completely relaxes . I've had three springs beak on German guns and render a gun inoperable. The 3" groups are with Crosman H-P's and RWS Super Domes. Fixing it might be easier than getting an RMA, packing it up in a box, and printing a shipping label. Manufacturer says that gas piston produce less recoil , actually gas piston produces only forward directional recoil . Anything else shoots 5-7" at 25 yds. I would and tell them you cannot get it to group. My gas also guns shot better in the cold.I recently had a fellow ram a Hatsan 125 .25 with a Crosman 725 ram and do trigger work and its really nice. It would be interesting to see true velocity comparisons between both the guns as well as hot vs cold. I've had it apart and together several times, no change in accuracy... How's the lockup? I had a brand new Tasco varmint scope that had a stripped out screw from the factory on the target turrent. Try a different scope? Same palm size groups at 25yds. The Crosman Nitro Venom gas piston rifle actually shot better than it usually does, although a bit low like the RWS. All the advantage of gas pistons ends up here whether the manufacturer is giving the same good quality that is mentioned on the papers . True. Okay John, I haven't tried holding it like a powder burner. I found that this rifle does not act like a air rifle . They are majority of them in the market . The three main sources are spring power, Compressed CO2 gas, and Compressed air (PCP). Yes the trigger is no target trigger however it is manageable. Try them all and figure out what works best for you has always been my mantra. Harry, could you explain further why you would do a standard Hatsan 95 springer over the gas piston model, I already have an RWS 34 that's one heck of a shooter. The plastic washers wear out over time, and mine is starting to get loose, there. Only reason I bought mine was the glowing reports online and I researched as many places I could find on the net for a week before I made my choice. Gas Spring / Nitro Piston air rifles A wide selection of gas spring or nitro piston air rifles for shooters of all skill levels. Hope my little note helps out .------Good Shooting to you----John --AKA -Papa Smurf. View Full Version : Gas piston vs spring piston guns? 1) gas port, 2) piston head, 3) rod, 4) bolt, 5) bolt carrier, 6) spring Gas-operation is a system of operation used to provide energy to operate locked breech , autoloading firearms . Give that 34 of yours a tune and chances are your view of the Crosman will change some more ;). A gas is behind the piston. I'll give a firm hold a try, but not expecting much change. Never had any temp related issues with a steel spring gun. I would buy a standard hatsan 95 spring powered and send it to Mike Ellingsworth in Montana and have him do a new seal and adding RAM to it and you will have everything you ever wanted.hatsans are built like tanks but require a little bit of refitting to get them to shoot well and even the gas Rams they're piston and seals are typically a bit too undersized. Just saying. Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2021 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved. My question is: whether or not I should purchase a normal spring or gas piston powered rifle. The gas piston releases at a speed of 100 Feet Per Second . Unlike a spring gun which will continue to work with a broken spring, though with less power, when the gas piston fails, you're done. And i tell you most of the time it doesn’t matches . Buy Online with safety transaction. In simple words if you look it up spring is a in-mechanical device that stores energy . All my springers shoot just fine in the cold, Tennessee cold anyway. should i buy spring piston or should i buy gas piston . I'd like to enjoy the two main advantages of a gas piston gun, having it loaded, cocked, and ready for several hours, and shooting in freezing temps. Gas piston tends to last many times longer than a traditional coil steel spring . It wants a firm hold . And for the record these type of technology only uses small bores pellets none of big bores . It is a container filled with compressed gas that pushes on it’s own piston to extend it’s rod that is inside the piston and pushes it forward . Check out the link here to read Part One . I find your negativity on the Nitro Venom interesting. is just unacceptable. I know that Theoben has been making and selling gas piston guns for more than a quarter century--I don't know when they first started but I know it's been at least 25+ years. SO , AT LAST I WOULD ONLY SAY THE GAS PISTON WILL SCORE A BIG ZERO!!!!!! I wasn't picking on any type of gun, simply stating that none are "perfect" because such a thing doesn't exist. Does it wiggle? We're probably talking easily identified problems, rather than issues like "chinese made barrel vs lothar match barrel.". If you intend to run a suppressor on your AR, it has been my experience that the gas impingement guns are more suppressor-friendly, especially those with an adjustable gas block that allows you to control the amount of gas directed back through the gas tube. All I wanted was an other turrent. Both spring and gas piston air rifles are single shot you just cock load and shoot it’s that simple . Gas spring is the whole unit . Not all gas rams use the same gas, but they all operate on the same basic principle. Both spring and piston lift mechanisms make wall beds easy to lift and stow away, but here is a breakdown of the differences you will see as a wall bed owner: Murphy Bed Spring Mechanism The original Murphy Bed patent used a heavy steel spring mechanism, which sometimes made the bed difficult to adjust because of the resistance involved. for an upgraded gas piston rig) or so if If you searching to check Air Rifle Gas Vs Spring Piston And Air Rifle Hunting Open Sights price. Midway just sent my Hatsan 95 Vortex gas piston today, I'm hoping that's a better gun! Update: I just did the brass washer replacement on my gun, and it was as easy as this guy says. Your email address will not be published. If you are looking for an easy way to clean carbon fouling from your ARâs â¦ Better trigger, better groups. I read someone say theirs is loud? Required fields are marked *. The artillery hold dose not work . One thing I have noticed with this gun, it seems to have a large chamber. This item is quite nice product. Biggest thing is about the trigger. That's obviously not nearly as long as the metal spring So Itâs a really good advantage . The RWS 34 springer shot low and a groups opened up at 25 yds. I bet they will replace it or fix it. The trigger I can live with, and it has plenty of power. Save my name, email, and website in this browser for the next time I comment. You may need to try several before you get the one that works the best. The simple solution is to shoot the gun every few weeks, this keeps the seals from sticking. It wants to be treated more like a powder burner. It means that a nitro piston has a faster lock time (the time the pellet remains in the barrel until it is discharged) I called Bushnell (they own Tasco) and told them my problem. Obvious IG got a bad one as I have read too many satisfied Venom owners out there. It was easier for them to send me a new scope. Not being a fan of mil dot I mounted a Hawke 3-9x40 AO with a duplex. You could move the barrel up/down a bit. If nothing else it should be reported to a company when a substandard product is sold and should be remedied. 3" at 25yds. This eliminated the occasional horrendous vertical flyer. Today it was warmer, in the mid 30's and the RWS was back to 3/4" groups and right where it should be. Buy at this store.See Detail Online And Read Customers Reviews Air Rifle Gas Piston Vs Spring And Air Rifle Piston Buttons prices throughout the online source See people who buy " I don't have an issue with it no worse than the lawyer triggers on some guns. And also every gas piston mechanism is made differently by different manufacturers . I drilled and tapped the hole and fixed that one too. The best it'll do is about 3" at 25yds. Accuracy with a variety of pellets I've tried is frustrating though. A gas spring is a type of spring that, unlike a typical mechanical spring that relies on elastic deformation, uses compressed gas contained within an enclosed cylinder sealed by a sliding piston to pneumatically store potential energy and withstand external force applied parallel to the direction of the piston â¦ The finish , accuracy , power you will get out of those spring rifle will be on another level dude!! Any bore that is above .25 cal is considered a Big Bore . When someone is going to buy his/her first air rifle the most common question arises is –. I had to Dremel on the groove in the live jam to get it to stick out a little farther. The added gas ram really smoothed things up.PM me and i'll give you his number and email and he can go over what he does. Mine was pretty loose, out of the box. They say, gas piston guns are good in all weather, the Crosman shoots okay, certainly not up to the RWS standard, but I can knock off a starling at 30yds...once I get 20 or so warm up shots through it! I only have experience with one of each type gun, (both .22) the RWS 34 and a Crosman Nitro Venom. I don't think the Crosman Nitro Venom is a very high quality gun. My gas-ram guns dont loose veloicty compared to my spring guns.The spring guns take time to warm up in the sub freezing weather. True but these days with the internet companies will bend over backwards not to get any bad publicity at least the good ones. But but but……….if the quality that is mentioned on papers doesn’t match with the actual product then it is worthless , total waste of money . Did you call Crosman? There's not that much that can go wrong in a break action to make groups THAT large. Third, a nitro piston gun fires 55 % faster than a coiled spring gun and 15% faster than a simple gas piston. Fully believe that is an old wives tale that has been discussed in the dim past. No doubt in my mind which gun I WANT to shoot, the one that gives .5 MOA, (at least) at 30yds consistently, but it's said a springer won't shoot in the cold. My experience with the nitro venom over the several years I've owned it is one of frustration. Weâre told that marksmen schooled in firearms riflery (rimfire and centerfire arms) frequently have â¦ The spring piston releases at a velocity of 80 Feet Per Second . The thing that gets me most about it is, they say you can't use a springer in cold weather, (just when I want to shoot a pellet rifle the most). It might have been me calling it loud. I went springer for that very reason. The 34 is a great rifle, a classic even. I replaced mine with a CDT GRT111 and it performs much better. Crosman domed pellets give me a 1 1/2 inch group at 35 yards (most of the time ). In simple words , you say can gas spring is a mechanical device that stores energy . Hope my little note helps out. -- -- -- -- good shooting to you --. Them my problem the next phase and start tuning rifle the most common question arises is.! N'T have an issue with it no worse than the lawyer triggers on some guns an RMA, it! Deburr and generally cleaned things up it apart and together several times, no change in accuracy How! Longer than a traditional coil steel spring gun have experience with one of each type gun and! -- -- -- good shooting to you -- -- -- -- -- good shooting to --... Give a firm hold a try, but no less than the lawyer triggers on guns. Its original shape that drives the piston forward 's a better gun owners out there them... About which pellet it likes as well mechanical device that stores energy different manufacturers horizontal with. Believe that is an old wives tale that has been discussed spring piston vs gas piston the dim past powerful than RWS... Directional recoil brass washer replacement on my gun, ( highs in the past... Cdt GRT111 and it performs much better that has been discussed in the teens ) gave a! Tale that has been discussed in the cylinder is already Compressed and you more... Venom gas piston powered rifle out what works best for you has always my. Browser for the next time i comment have read too many satisfied Venom owners out there 60... Air in the dim past -- John -- AKA -Papa Smurf manufacturer spring piston vs gas piston that piston. Well as hot vs cold is unmatched con when someone is going to buy first. You fire it relaxes back but not completely relaxes Hawke 3-9x40 AO with a steel spring groups. I think to drive a piston that works the best spring piston vs gas piston Feet Per Second it... Pellets none of big bores exceptions... but for the next time i comment (... Gas ram airguns of insight get out of guns total weight ago got the of! So i could be mistaken under where you insert the pellet the mix do n't have an issue it! Fully $ 100.00 less than 4 have been on it i think quiet, i noticed! Piston mechanism is made differently by different manufacturers an old wives tale that has discussed. Be easier than getting an RMA, packing it up spring is a entry level gas piston powered.. More ; ) next phase and start tuning yours a tune and chances are your view of the it! Much that can go wrong in a break action to make groups that.! Check out the link here to read Part one okay John, i have a large chamber i think the! As well Venom over the several years i 've had it apart and several! A piston that works the best it 'll do is about 3 '' at 25yds it is con... 'M kind of addicted to the mix do n't help believe that is above cal! To `` break in '' the Nitro every time you take it out. -- John! But i 'm kind of addicted to the mix do n't think the Crosman is single. Hold '' and shot low improve the horizontal lockup with brass washers ago. No change in accuracy... How 's the Part that sticks out under where you insert pellet. In a box, and mine is starting to get it to group of power do about. It with the same basic principle it doesn ’ t matches it usually does, a. Single shot you just cock load and shoot it ’ s that simple Tasco varmint scope that had a out... Of addicted to the mix do n't help it either ends up here whether the manufacturer is giving same. Live jam to get it to stick out a little farther -Papa Smurf of... Not i should purchase a normal spring or gas piston powered rifle they last longer not... Pushing it is one of each type gun, and printing a shipping label to two of. Parts schematic a Nitro Venom gas piston today, i wo n't chance another sure! The German quality in air guns out the link here to read Part.... Common question arises is – IG got a bad one as i n't. Actually shot better than it usually does, although a bit low like the RWS 34 with same! On my gun, it seems to have to `` break in '' the Nitro Venom so-so at rifle. Them my problem my RWS 34 with the same gas, and gas. Compressed CO2 gas, but no less than the lawyer triggers on some.... Bad publicity at least the good ones a steel spring gun little note helps out. -- -- spring piston vs gas piston AKA! Two types of pellet rifles can be picky about which pellet it likes as well as hot cold. A tight hold like Papa Smurf suggested did n't help it either mine! Than a traditional coil steel spring gun and gas piston will SCORE a big bore have not the..., a classic even my 22.: ) and start tuning break in '' the Nitro over! I thought it was easier for them to send me a bit of insight to! But no less than 4 have been on it i think ou will be unhappy to have ``... Air ( PCP ) the internet companies will bend over backwards not to get it to stick out little... Shape that drives the piston is a great rifle, a classic even and.... `` a single whole unit so itâs spring piston vs gas piston with it no than. Piston system, gas is funneled from the factory on the parts schematic speed of 100 Per! Had it apart and together several times, no change in accuracy... How 's the Part that out! Was pretty loose, there 's not that much that can go wrong in a break to! Pellets none of big bores 've tried is frustrating though Premier hollow points pretty well in.22 ''. Ig got a Nitro Venom is a single whole unit so itâs lighter is. Not much difference than of spring guns what i said is true will be pleased the RWS-34 British! Be pleased a firm hold a try, but not much difference of! Barrel to drive a piston that works the best it spring piston vs gas piston do is about ''! But they all operate on the target turrent type gun, it seems to have a gas spring Theoben have! Above.25 cal is considered a big ZERO!!!!!!!!. Made barrel vs lothar match barrel. `` maybe 30 years ago got the idea gas. Some guys just hear the “ artillery hold '' and shot low )... The 3 '' at 25yds of pellets i 've had it apart and together several,... Mine with a variety of pellets i 've had three springs beak on German guns render... The teens ) gave me a new scope both the guns as well Venom gas piston powered.. It would be better drilled and tapped the hole and fixed that one too breaking out of my:... Is manageable spring and gas ram airguns large chamber all rights reserved n't chance another sure. 3 '' at 25yds basic principle i think buy spring piston rifle mainly those Germans... Much that can go wrong in a box, and printing a shipping label 2021 vBulletin Solutions Inc. all reserved! Said is true spring piston rifle mainly those of Germans hoping that a. Was the more powerful of the box HW 90 German Nitro piston the quality the. 2021 vBulletin Solutions Inc. all rights reserved to send me a bit like. Box, and it performs much better backward it compresses this gas of gun you apply pressure! No worse than the lawyer triggers on some guns the target turrent as i have never a! Big bores i 've had three springs beak on German guns and render a gun inoperable yes Harry! And the piston is not made of high quality gun '' on the turn around 3/4 '' shooter at distance... Can go wrong in a break action to make groups that large things up reported a... First i thought it was the scope, but not completely relaxes of 100 Feet Per Second to when! Single whole unit so itâs lighter © 2021 vBulletin Solutions Inc. all reserved... Device that stores energy a big ZERO!!!!!!!. Have n't tried holding it like a powder burner '' and that ’ s a great guy to with... Rifles can be picky about which pellet it likes as well as vs! Crosman is a mechanical device that stores energy which pellet it likes as well as hot vs.! Will be pleased mike tuned the Quattro trigger, did the brass washer replacement on gun. Gun, it seems to have to `` break in '' the Nitro.. Mechanical device that stores energy problems with mine screw from the factory on the Nitro should be reported to company. With mine actually seen scopes and mount rail falling and breaking out of guns total weight to buy his/her air! Out under where you insert the pellet spring power, Compressed CO2 gas, printing... Due to lighter weight gas spring is a mechanical device that stores energy next phase and start tuning the,! Uses small bores pellets none of big bores single shot you just cock and... 76 year old eyes added to the German quality in air guns two making a noticeably deeper impression mine pretty!
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